Hi, I have seborrheic dermatitis on my scalp for a year now and have tried all sorts of products and nothing really helped. I’m thinking about trying Nystatin on my scalp, but I read on the internet that several people who use Nystatin are experiencing hair loss from it. Mostly these people use it to treat other conditions. Do you notice any hair loss?
Hi Vincent, no Ii do not experience any hair loss. But then again I don’t apply any of it to my scalp, so that would be weird.
Nystatin might come in different concentrations, I’m not sure, so if you can, note the concentration of the nystatin when you read stories regarding hair loss. It could be that the type used in those cases is more potent than the one recommended here.
I promised myself to stop putting oils to my face, but just had to try borage oil on my eye lids and in between my eyes yesterday.
My skin looked great from the moment I put it on and still does after 20 hours!
If the John Vale Skin Clear programme does not work I will try borage on the rest of my face.
Sorry to hear about the short relapse. Luckily the Nystatin was still effective though. And yeah your hypothesis is in-line with my research. There appear to be strains of malassezia which are able to adapt and become resistant to the Nystatin. Additionally, as Ian pointed out in one of his comments there are other micro-organisms which may be causing symptoms that closely resemble seborrheic dermatitis.
In terms of the Malassezia, I strongly believe it effects some of us due to a combination of compromised barrier function, which is related to fatty acid metabolism and/or local fatty acid synthesis. Perhaps this is cause by another bacteria or something within our bodies that prevents optimal immune function. Overall though, topical still seem to play an important role as they allow us to live life while be figure out the underlying issue (which I still believe is important for long term).
Have started work on a second edition of the book, hoping to go even deeper and really get to the core of the issue (and improve the structure of the last chapter).
Happy holidays and best of luck in the New Year!
All the best.
Just wanted to chime in on the Isopropyl Myristate and Nystatin. If I’m not mistaken, you could get a custom formulation of Nystatin cream from your local pharmacy. At-least this is how it works here in Canada. Nystatin is one of the most commonly used anti-fungals, so it really shouldn’t be a problem. Perhaps you could even get it in a water based solution.
As for the hit and miss, this seems to apply universally
Happy holidays! And best wishes for the New Year!
Hope all is well. Just wanted to chime in.
Not sure where you are located, but I believe you may be able to obtain a custom formulation of nystatin cream from your local pharmacy.
Let me know if you pursue this idea.
Happy holidays and hope you have a wonderful 2016!
Best of luck.
Interested note regarding the Crotamiton. Have been adding this topic to my research lately, will update once I have more information compiled. Did you end up trying this out yet?
PS> Also have a bit of research papers on acne, perhaps these may be useful to you. Will somehow send over via email.
All the best.
The clear skin program looks promising and will likely have very good results. With time though, it appears the best approach is one that you can easily integrate in your daily life. Juicing was just something that I’ve been too lazy to be consistent with. Currently, I just make sure to eat a certain amount of raw vegetables every single day, drink lots of water, exercise and all the general good stuff. However, I’ve also been using the Biom8 pretty much every single day, so hard to say if it’s doing all the work.
How have things progressed since? Any updates on the Probiotic Repair Spray usage?
Hope you can finally find something that resolves things for you. Still busy compiling research and expanding the work. Will update if I find something that may be useful/applicable to you.
All the best and happy holidays!
I trust you are doing well.
Thank you for your suggestion. I live in Istanbul Turkey and here we only have nystatin for oral use. But if you think that it helps to reduce acne, I will try to get help from Germany with custom formula.
I tried not to apply nystatin directly on face but this time the risk of sd appeared which I never want to face again.
I hope I can find a way to have it in Istanbul.
The probiotic spray is great since it does not make my face worse. I find it important to always wash my face before using it.
I’m having a break from putting anything on my face a few weeks now. Except for borage oil on eye lids which works great.
The John Vale Skin clear programme is not just juicing. The 30 day programme consists of soups and sallads with chicken and salmon as well.
I will be starting it on January 4th. Will come back with results.
Just to continue with my updates here.
My routine has been mostly similar to what I’ve been doing for the past month, with a couple minor changes.
As of the past week I now just occasionally use Michael’s BIOM8 Oil as a cleanser and mix it with shampoo in the shower. I didn’t notice results from using it as a daily moisturiser after several weeks, but it works just fine as a gentle cleanser so I continue to use it this way (better than throwing it away, after all). Then I use a simple light moisturiser with minimal ingredients (Sebamed Clear Face Gel) and that’s it.
I wash my face, and then apply Skinoren gel (15% Azelaic Acid) as always (can’t tell if it’s helping my SD at all but it helps my acne, so I’ll continue to use it). I used to apply Sebclair (aka Promiseb) cream at this stage, but I replaced it with a very interesting cream I found called Ducray Kelual DS Cream. Like Sebclair it has piroctone olamine which is an antifungal, but the interesting thing is that it also happens to have crotamiton, which I mentioned in a previous post was the ingredient used in a study to treat demodex mites. The fact that they included crotamiton lends further credence to my theory that a demodex involvement shouldn’t be entirely ruled out as a cause of symptoms that manifest very similarly to SD.
Here’s the full ingredients list for the Ducray Kelual DS cream:
Aqua, Caprylic/Capric Triglyceride, Cyclomethicone, Dicaprylyl Ether,Cetearyl Alcohol, Acetamide MEA, Glycolic Acid, Guandine Carbonate, Glyceryl Stearate, Plymethyl Methacrylate, Ceteareth-33, Crotamiton, Piroctone Olamine, Serenoa Serrulata fruit Extract (Serenoa Serrulata Extract), Tetrasodium EDTA.
I don’t do raw honey masks anymore because they had no effect on my SD and were a pain to do. I’ve been wanting to keep my routine as simple and stress-free as possible and I’ve kept it that way, and have no intentions of doing otherwise anymore.
As for results, if there have been any it’s been quite minimal. I think the sides of my nose might be slightly less pink, but it’s hard to say.
But to echo what I said in my last post, I continue to suspect that I might have demodex involvement because my dermatitis appears to manifest itself a bit differently from the standard SD symptoms. Namely, from the photos and accounts of SD sufferers I’ve noticed that there’s this tendency towards concentrated patches of redness that look like flakey rashes. I would describe what I have as more of a diffuse pinkness across my central face (minus the forehead, which is completely clear) that gradually fades out towards my cheeks, and my nasolabial folds and chin crease are a bit redder than that surrounding pinkness. Basically, I always look like I have a mild sunburn.
Therefore I want to rule out the possibility of demodex involvement. In the study I posted previously, they recommend using a 10% crotamiton cream/lotion for 2-4 weeks. The Ducray Kelual DS cream contains crotamiton (which could be why I’m seeing extremely marginal improvement, if any) but judging from its location on the ingredient list I’d say it’s only a fraction of the 10% concentration recommended by the study. There is a cream available OTC in the UK called Eurax that does contain 10% – I ordered it a while back but then I left the country for the holiday and didn’t receive it in time, but now that I’ve returned I’m going to start using it.
So for the next 2 weeks I’m going to apply Eurax to my entire face morning and night. If I see improvement I’ll continue the course for an additional 2 weeks. If I don’t see any improvement whatsoever, then I at least have eliminated it as a possibility and can just focus on it being a case of SD.
Michael, I’ll be sure to report back about my results after this trial. Interesting that you’re also encountering more research about demodex!
Also interesting about that person who didn’t see results from the BIOM8 Oil, like myself, but noticed improvement from the Probiotic Spray. I’ll bear that in mind. I want to give this crotamiton trial a proper shot first, but if it doesn’t work out then I’d be interested in trying out the spray, because if it is indeed SD then I clearly need a different angle of attack. Beyond the Kelual DS cream I’m currently using and another cream I found that contains climbazole and piroctone olamine, I’ll be a bit exhausted for options on the SD treatment front if I end up having to return to it. I don’t suppose there’d be any discount available for those curious in trying out the spray after giving the oil a go with no results? No worries if not.
Cheers and Happy New Year!
Here is a topical probiotic spray that looks very intresting:
Only available in US and Canada.
I think that in a lot of skin issues the skin is lacking from good bacteria to keep the bad bacteria at a low level.
Creams like antifugals and steroids will kill the good bacteria and therefor never cure the skin in the long run.
The ideal thing should be to optimise the gut health with healthy foods like the John Vale Skin clear programme. It’s free for download. And also use oil free topical probiotics.
And here is another one designen for rosacea and acne that doesn’t kill good bacteria on the skin like steroids do:
No oils work for me. The oil free biom8 probiotic spray does not make my SD worse.
The last weeks I have only washed my face with water when taking a shower. My face has improved by 50% from this.
Will start the Skin clear programme later this month.
As it happens, I’m also experimenting with Skinoren gel and Kelual DS Creme right now after an (short) unsuccessful trial with BIOM8 Oil. For the time being I decided to leave the Kelual out to see what the skinoren gel does on its own. So far I would also say that it helps with pimples but not so much with the SD scaling and redness, but it is still too early to definitely tell.
I tried out the Kelual Creme in addition for some days which didn’t seem to make much of a difference. But this was not an adequate treatment period. I recognized though that the Kelual has a tendency to try out the skin, a little bit like the Skinoren gel. This was also a reason why I decided against using both compounds together.
With regard to this Demodex theory that you referred to: I think for myself I can pretty much rule that out. I applied a whole tube of Soolantra Creme (Ivermectin) over several weeks onto the affected areas of my face but had no positive results from it. But let’s see what turns out of your Eurax experiment.
Wow, then we’re in quite a similar boat! I’m definitely a fan of azelaic acid in terms of treating acne, though I was hopeful that it’d have more of an effect on my SD seeing as some research points to it being helpful in that regard. Scaling hasn’t been much of a problem for me (for all I know the azelaic acid could be the reason why?), but my primary concern has always been the redness and it hasn’t had any noticeable effect on that. That said, the way I see it, it helps my acne and at least doesn’t appear to be aggravating my SD (which I worry might be the case if I were to use other, more irritating acne treatments like Retin-A), so I’m going to keep using it regardless.
It’s understandable that a combination of azelaic acid and the Kelual DS creme can be a bit too drying, as the latter contains a decent amount of glycolic acid. I noticed that myself when I’ve been using the two together. I tried a “treatment phase” of the Kelual DS creme, using it both morning and night for 2 weeks (as is suggested on the manufacturer’s website), but now Intend to just use it twice a week and only at night. On those nights I’m thinking that instead of using the Skinoren and Kelual together I’ll just use the Kelual, to minimise the dryness/irritation.
Sorry to hear that the ivermectin cream didn’t have any positive results for you. I’m not getting my hopes high that crotamiton will be my saviour, as promising as the results of that study are, but I want to at least go through a proper treatment course of it as otherwise it’ll always be nagging me in the back of my mind. Moreover, giving it 2 weeks isn’t much of a commitment – I was willing to do the same trial period for antifungal creams like the Nystatin but, unlike those creams, the crotamiton cream doesn’t appear to have any problematic ingredients that will almost assuredly clog my pores and wreak havoc on my face!
Everything is good with me.
Hopefully you can find it in your area. Let me know how things turn out (might be useful for other readers who happen to be from you part of the world).
All the best.
Thanks for the update and the tip on the Probiotic Repair Spray usage.
Is the borage oil only working for the eyelids?
Look forward to hearing your results from the John Vale program.
Hope you enjoyed the holidays!
All the best!
Thanks for the detailed update. You seem to have a good and well thought out approach. Really interested to see how things turn out.
As for the oil not working for you, it does seem like it stems from that fact that your issue may be caused by a different fungal strain, microorganism or potential demodex themselves.
That cream you mentioned (Ducray) seems to have fairly promising ingredients. Thanks for brining it to my attention.
As for the discount. Definitely not a problem. Just message me via the contact form and will send you details.
Hope you finally find some relief.
Have a great 2016!
Thanks for linking that product. Definitely looks interesting. Let me know if you give it a try. If the bacteria used can actually convert urea into nitric oxide, it should potentially be very helpful for SD. The Biom8 Probiotic Spray contains arginine for this same reason. However, the specific probiotics used serve a different purpose.
In terms of creams and topical products not really being a solution, I do partially agree. This was my thinking for quite some time. Obviously humans shouldn’t need to really on externally applied things in order to be healthy. However, todays environments and food choices/availability seems to have impacted many levels of human health and immunity.
Plus my experience with how well Biom8 has worked for me has impacted my opinion as well. Perhaps a topical that can help you regain control of your skin and allow you to slowly focus on rebuilding all other aspects of the immune system free from stress (caused by SD) can be crucially beneficial. Most of my research has pointed to the fatty acid as being one of the key aspects of seborrheic dermatitis, thus I think modifying the sebum’s composition is pivotal to long term results. However, everyone is different and as long as we all share our experience I believe we can create a solid foundation of knowledge for others unfortunate enough to travel down the same path.
Look forward to hearing how the program goes.
Best of luck!
Sorry to hear the Biom8 didn’t work out for you.
One thing that I just hypothesized, is that potentially the products that may be helpful in acne might be negatively impacting the skins protective barrier. Thus, allowing the bacteria activity to cause inflammation and disruption of the skins normal cycle. Will see if I can research this hypothesis further and update you guys on any potential findings.
Look forward to any updates.
All the best.
Just downloaded a bunch of research papers on azelaic acid and the first thing that jumped out right away:
Azelaic acid is available currently as a 15% gel approved in the United States for the treatment of rosacea. It is a 9-carbon dicarboxylic acid obtained from cultures of Pityrosporum ovale.
Pityrosporum ovale is a different name of malassezia, the fungus most commonly documented as the culprit behind seborrheic dermatitis. Haven’t read much else, but this just jumped right out at me. Will update once I actually read some more of the papers.
All the best.